Originally by: Thanos Draicon

---

This thread fails.

---

Originally by: Alski

---

Face the truth, this is an MMO, and CCP wants you to play it as one.

"hey everyone I'm undocking in my XYZ ship come protect me!!"

By that logic, when entering into a potentialey hostile situation, a carrier doesent need any battleships, and the battleships don't need any support, and the support don't need any tacklers right? carrier > all? nope. everyone needs support in a potentialey hostile situation.

But all of those ships can mount some sprt of DEFENSE..

And 1b isk ship with no defences in a game where you are NEVER trueley safe anywhere, while carreying upto or beyond multiple billions of isks worth of loot is exactley what i'd call a potentialey hostile situation.

Exactly so why does it not have the right to defend itsself?

Becides anything else, what are you going to fit in those slots? a few ECM won't do anything to save you, sensor damps even less, and a captal armor rep will let you tank about 650+ DPS (thats a lot) with no hardeners... in a ship that is NOT soposed to be a combat capeable vessel.

---

Originally by: Jirai Grepher

---

Freighters are meant to have an escort. They are transportation ships. they go station to station. that is it. they are unarmed because they do not need nor require to be armed.


Deal with it.

---

Originally by: Tortun Nahme

---

and CCP says they are worknig as intended so i guess your argument is invalid too

---

Originally by: Alski

---

Originally by: Par Bobot

---

But all of those ships can mount some sprt of DEFENSE..

---

Not allways, haveing been ECMed in my carrier and seen 140+ second locktimes on anouther CAPITAL ship, not to mention smaller stuff, and basicley done nothing but sit around and watch the fight around me while all the ECM ships were picked off by *SUPPORT* i can safley say that if you are one and they are many, you will not have any defence no matter what you fit.

Originally by: Par Bobot

---

Exactly so why does it not have the right to defend itsself?

---

Because CCP doesent want it to, to promote teamwork and to promote the idea that all ship classes need support from anouther class.

Also because its not a combat ship, and if it had any form of capital class tanking it would be abused by tanking missions and complexs due to the nature of capital repair modules / tanking.

Any ECM would be useless, unless it had lots and lots of mid-slots for it and then it risks becomeing either a weaponless supertank or a combat ship, it should be neither.

Originally by: Par Bobot

---

Offense and Defense are 2 different things

---

The best offence is a good defence, and vs. multiple targets with supior firepower it can't really be anything but a VERY good defence which instantley also makes it a possable offensive weapon.

---

Originally by: Vandalias

---

Just to throw an idea out there:

Give freighters a few slots, but cut their base cargo capacity by 50-75%. That way if you want to carry around a ton of stuff you have to devote your slots to cargo expanders. If not you can put up a mediocre tank.

---

Originally by: Slate Fistcrunch

---

Adding slots to a freighter would be a monumental mistake. The argument I always hear is that they are too weak or they can't defend themselves and having module slots would fix this. If you want them to be tougher, then request them to be tougher. You can't add low slots to a freighter because their cargo capacity has been carefully calculated and having lows would potentially break that limit now or down the road when new modules are released. Low slots would also change the freighter's time to align for warp which is also very carefully implemented. Med slots would give them the potential to serve an offensive role (ECM burst) which makes no sense for that ship class. Hi slots, well what use would a freighter have for hi slots?

Seriously, if you want a ship with modules, fly a different ship. If you believe freighters need an hp boost, argue that point using valid ideas. I'll give you a head start: cheaper t2, overloading / heat, faction ammo, more players in ships that can do more dps, ships coming out that can do more dps, more public info about how to down a freighter, etc.

Give the "give freighters slots" argument a rest.

---

Originally by: Slate Fistcrunch

---

Originally by: Par Bobot

---

Originally by: Slate Fistcrunch

---

cut

---

Sorry but the ship is unbalanced and needs balancing.

---

What is unbalanced? It is designed to haul stuff. Is it not hauling enough or is it hauling too much?
If you are saying the ship is too weak, then say you want the HP boosted on the freighter.
Adding module slots to a ship that was designed not to have module slots changes the role of the ship. I point you to other hauling ships if you don't like freighters.

---

Originally by: Tortun Nahme

---

and you are wrong

---

Originally by: Christari Zuborov

---

Originally by: Missy Saints

---

Edited by: Missy Saints on 24/09/2007 02:10:08

Originally by: Shiodome

---

Edited by: Shiodome on 24/09/2007 03:59:14
Edited by: Shiodome on 24/09/2007 03:58:47
every other ship the pilot has choice over how they fly, CCP hasn't made any other ship where your option is 'fly with a gang, or have zero defence'. every other ship has bonuses which 'direct' you in the way it's meant to be used (or slot layouts), but at least there's options (it's often very clear which the best option is, but if you want to fit an ewar mammoth, or an armor tanked harpy you have to option.)

don't see why frieghter pilots should be the only group to have the way they fly dictated to them if they want to keep their ship?


EXACTLTY
and as has been pointed out in another frieghter thread recently, it's not possible to protect any significant cargo and still maintain a profit margin (which is after all the whole point for many people moving items in bulk?) - e.g for a 3 bill cargo... the attacker can field over a dozen suicide domi's and still come out ahead... but if the convoy fields enough ships to defend against those domi's all profit margin is lost.

i don't think freighters should be able to uber tank solo, but having 'some' small tank would allow them to survive with a smaller escort and thus maintain some profit margin?

---

Originally by: Tortun Nahme

---

ups drivers transports

and freight trains, shipping trucks, oceanic freighters, and heavy cargo jets carrying valuables have escorts, even in "safe" countries

---

Originally by: Shadowsword

---

If freighters had slots people wouldn't tank them, they'd fit overdrives/inertials, and the market would be hurt even more by afk traders.

---

Originally by: Van Steiza

---

Awwwwwww A frieghter is a frieghter they haul **** end of.
Maybe a Hp boost or the abilty to fit ONE dmg control and THAT is it.

But to be quite frigging honest there great the way they are.

Pardon or what ever your name is I hate you I hope I do see you in a frieghter :D

---

Originally by: Wendat Huron

---

People still fly freighters?

---

Originally by: the'internet is'for'****

---

Okay so we want to treat freighters at capital ships right?
So okay, let's treat them as such, give them some fitting slots and BAN them from .5 - 1.0 space..

OH wait.. that would just make you whine more.

Make some friends, have those friends scout for you and escort you.

---

Originally by: Solant

---

You, sir, are an idiot.

Freighters are not designed to fly solo in any capacity. Get some friends, or gtfo.

End of discussion, this thread is a waste of kilobytes.

---

Originally by: Zephlin Abath

---

Originally by: Par Bobot

---

Originally by: Solant

---

You, sir, are an idiot.

Freighters are not designed to fly solo in any capacity. Get some friends, or gtfo.

End of discussion, this thread is a waste of kilobytes.

---

lol typical PVP'r response, insults and no constructive input

---

Insults aside, he is right.
CCP would have already spoken up or would have fixed it already if they intended it to be a solo hauler don't you think?

---

Originally by: Admiral Pelleon

---

When is the last time you saw a container ship with flak cannons and armor?

---

Originally by: Vateh

---

It seems like the issue with freighter began when they began to drop loot. This cause the gank squads to begin to take down freighters. Instead of giving freighters slots, or banning them to low security space, the easiest solution seems to reverse the changes that made the freighters targets in the first place by removing the loot dropped by frieghters or just make freighters drop metal scraps and no cargo. This would solve the problem with the lowest amout of impact on the game

---

Originally by: MasterEnt

---

Freighters are made to require support, get some

---

Originally by: 343conspiracy43345

---

Do you guys not understand the importance of scouts, warp to zero, and logoffski tactics?

---

Originally by: Captian Internet

---

Originally by: Par Bobot

---

Edited by: Par Bobot on 25/09/2007 17:01:56

Originally by: 343conspiracy43345

---

Do you guys not understand the importance of scouts, warp to zero, and logoffski tactics?

---

Let me ask, have you ever flown one alt? in 0.0 that helps but still a dread could warp in on you after you jump in and lock you before you get a chance to align for warp.

Scouts?? in high sec whats he gonna do?? "look out boys theres a hauler by the gate , might be a ganker scout" scans you bumps you enough till the gang arrives..

logoofski?? "boys someones in this .9 system log"

Point is ship needs to be balanced by adding slots?? or buffing shields.. FFS my drake has 4x the shields.

Friends cannot agro gankers , unless a war taget in empire, so no help there .

---

No tank what so ever

also the ancient art of Pre repping eludes you perhaps? but having 1 logistics ship there to pre rep can extend your lifespan to give you those crucial seconds needed for survival

---

Originally by: Tassadar Beta

---

Edited by: Tassadar Beta on 25/09/2007 20:02:37
Freighters do not need fixing in my opinion, I won't state why because the OP will just blindly say no that what I state actually means they should be boosted.

If you think they need fixing go make a well constructed post in the ideas section of the forum, instead of an unconstructive rant. I read this thread and I was really disappointed .

But I don't think you will make a well constructed post, because you are too busy reading what people post and interpreting it in whatever way you want so it supports your argument. Which in the end will simply turn this thread into a flamefest and no-one will actually listen to you, because you're just whining and not suggesting something balanced/constructive in the correct section of the forums.

---

Originally by: isca

---

Edited by: isca on 26/09/2007 11:28:50
Edited by: isca on 26/09/2007 11:27:33

sry, they need escorts, CCP never wanted to introduce them in the first place, they ain't going to add slots for reasons already mentioned

---

Originally by: Tortun Nahme

---

tell me how many ships can survive a concentrated assault even with slots?

---

Originally by: Cornucopian

---

hey moaners, how about adding to the 21 page thread instead of creating a new one: stop whining.

request a lock for thread spammage.

---

Originally by: Death Kill

---

Originally by: Par Bobot

---

Originally by: Thanos Draicon

---

This thread fails.

---

Exactly what I would expect from a pvp toon.

---

EVE doesnt have toons, go back to wow.

---